ME symptomatic crash after Sauna

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Have you tried buffered vitamin C? One form has calcium, magnesium and potassium, and there's another form called sodium ascorbate (with no calcium, etc.) You might tolerate these better.

Taking a bit of a high dose of vitamin C (plain ascorbic acid) at night is making a world of difference for my sleep. A "bit of a high dose" is 2000 mg after dinner and 3000 mg. before bed and 3000 more in the middle of the night. Vitamin C ameliorates glutamate-induced excitotoxicity.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25701025
http://web.stanford.edu/group/hopes/cgi-bin/hopes_test/vitamin-c/

I'm not trying to derail your thread here, I'm explaining all this as a lead up to the fact that sodium ascorbate did NOT help me with sleep, despite being a form of vitamin C, and it left me feeling flat. And I didn't try the buffered form with calcium because calcium was part of my problem in not sleeping.

Which leads to my point that if you try a buffered form of vitamin C, you might tolerate it and it might work, or it might not work the same as regular ascorbic acid did for you. I don't know why the sodium ascorbate did not help me with sleep, unlike plain ascorbic acid, but that's what happened (or, rather, didn't happen).

I wonder if you would tolerate liposomal vitamin C better? I know it's pricey. Here's a thread on making your own: https://forums.phoenixrising.me/ind...o-make-liposomal-vitamin-c-for-viruses.38867/
Didn't see this reply sorry. So Vitamin C - well firstly I think I must be intolerant to it - is that even possible? I take buffered in small amounts, or even drink fruit juices high in vitamin c (say 1 litre for example) and I get irritation. Essentially the only form I think that would work for me is topical or IV. However before I reached Vitamin C tolerance - which took one week at 3000mg per day. I noticed that my symptoms almost disappeared overnight when I took this dosage level. I now use trans-dermal patches as it's the only way I can (supposedly) get large amounts of vitamin C into my body. Problem is there is no scientific proof these even work and I am not even sur emyself!!

I wish there was a way I could be sure the trans dermals do work, even though they appear to have lowered inflammation overnight, I really cannot be sure if it's just my imagination. Also my chronic dehydration has only been helped with the trans dermal patches. Large amounts of vitamin C are the only thing that help my dehydration. So I do think they must work, but it still feels anecdotal.

As for buffered vitamin C I tried that and it had the same effect.

How does the home made one differ from buffered and absorbic @Mary ? I am just intrigued as I am happy to give this a go but want to be sure it's worthit :) I checked out your link, I just can't see the difference between crystals and absorbic powder? Although my Nutritionist did recommend crystals so maybe I am missing a trick?

Thanks,
 

Mary

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firstly I think I must be intolerant to it - is that even possible?
I think almost anything is possible with this illness! Seriously - people have developed sensitivities they never had before they became ill. I'm very fortunate in that I'm not sensitive to very much.
I wish there was a way I could be sure the trans dermals do work, even though they appear to have lowered inflammation overnight, I really cannot be sure if it's just my imagination. Also my chronic dehydration has only been helped with the trans dermal patches. Large amounts of vitamin C are the only thing that help my dehydration. So I do think they must work, but it still feels anecdotal.
One way to find out if they are truly helping you would be to stop them for a few days, and then restart, and see what difference, if any, you see. Although if something is truly helping me, even if I don't know how or why, I generally don't want to stop it! But I think that would be a fair test. And lots of drugs are administered transdermally. Pain meds, nicotine patches, lots of things. I think you can OD on patches, depending on what they are delivering to the body. So I don't see why vitamin C could not be administered in a similar way.

Gravity was just anecdotal until Isaac Newton formulated a scientific theory about it.

I know, you want scientific testing proving the transdermal C is working. I don't know if you'll get it, though it seems there must be some research somewhere about this. But even if you don't find any, I would definitely keep doing what you're doing as long as it seems to be of benefit.

How does the home made one differ from buffered and absorbic @Mary ? I am just intrigued as I am happy to give this a go but want to be sure it's worthit :) I checked out your link, I just can't see the difference between crystals and absorbic powder?
The homemade stuff is liposomal vitamin C. You make it with ascorbic acid and lecithin, I don't know of any difference between crystals and powder. This article by Dr. Mercola explains what liposomal technology is - supposedly vitamin C in liposomal form is much less likely to irritate the digestive tract and is much better absorbed, perhaps even rivaling IV vitamin C in bioavailability. Dr. Mercola does want to sell his product (other companies make it too) so you might want to do your own research on this. Liposomal vitamin C is more costly than plain ascorbic acid, so people have made their own, which supposedly is just as effective but much cheaper.

I have no idea whether or not you would react badly to liposomal vitamin C. You might, or might not. The link I gave you talks about ways to make your own. And there is a simple inexpensive method using a blender which is supposed to be as good as the expensive stuff you can buy on-line or in health food stores.
 
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Hi @Mary . I've been using the Liposamal now since about Nov 24th. I am not sure if it has had an effect yet but I suspect I will know for certain when it runs out. Coincidentally the thirst and dehydration only appear to become really bad when my immune system is fending something off. I know when it's not because my energy levels are almost normal, whereas as soon as I get something they dip. Most people with ME wouldn't notice but because the time between dips is long enough I can actually see them occurring now.

As for other PEM relievers I'm still using the cordyceps and reishi when I need to, to power through a cold or to help myself get going at the weekends if I have things to do. I'd say I am more or less in remission, symptoms have disappeared, the issue now is whether I can tolerate exercise or not. Assuming I get over this cold/bug that everyone in my office has got, I should be able to test my theory over christmas.

But I am still expecting symptom onset gradually over time, as happened in March.
 
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